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July 4th 2013 Liberty Day  Rating:  Rating
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 Posted: Wed Jul 11th, 2012 06:58 pm
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Joe Kelley
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Two directions are possible from this moment on as proven by historical precedent. Either be subjected to suffering by Legalized Criminals and be forced to pay all debts collected in that evil enterprise or move in the direction of Liberty.

Make my day.

How about July 4th 2013?

If by that date the American people, as one, have invented, produced, and supplied a number of competitive legal monies, then those American people will take back their power to prosper, at will, for their own and for posterity.

Sign on is spirit or sign on in actual reality, either way the days will move in a direction and the Legal Criminals score their progress with or without your willful participation toward their goal of absolute despotism.

May God have mercy on our souls.

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 Posted: Thu Mar 14th, 2013 12:12 am
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kurtwaters
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I have been perusing this forum for days now. Lot's of stuff here. I am currently puzzled.

I have been trying to understand this concept of "liberty day" and there is something that confuses me.

Am I correct in understanding that you describe the United States Government as well as some of the governments of other countries as political machines that manipulate and are manipulated by the market forces? (the nebulous entity?)

Furthermore,  am I correct in understanding you to describe these "market forces"  as being controlled by a relatively small group (when compared with the world population as a whole) ?

And if the answer to these two questions is yes, I do not see  how  refusing to pay income taxes and creating a competing medium of exchange accomplishes very much.

However, if the answer to one or both of the above questions is no, then I see liberty day as a possible solution with several logistical steps still needing to be developed.

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 Posted: Thu Mar 14th, 2013 01:01 pm
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Joe Kelley
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Thanks Mike,

I think these are vital questions.

Am I correct in understanding that you describe the United States Government as well as some of the governments of other countries as political machines that manipulate and are manipulated by the market forces? (the nebulous entity?)
No

Market Forces can be an accurate list of names of people who make decisions as to what they will choose when they can afford a choice between what each one thinks is better instead of what each one thinks is worse.

As such a market force moves power from many to the few when the few have something that the many want, and so the few offer that supply to meet that powerful demand.

An illustrative example is to place on the shelf in every food store on the planet earth a bag of very good looking, very good tasting, and very nourishing apples and on the same shelf right next to those bags of exemplary food are bags of rotten, smelly, putrid, balls of poop, called apples, but they are balls of poop, and the real apples are priced half the price of the counterfeit apples, and in this thought experiment you are expected to measure the power flowing to the producer who puts the apples on the shelf, and you are to measure, accurately, the power flowing to the counterfeiters who put the balls of poop on the same shelf for twice the price as the genuine articles.

The idea is to measure actual market forces, not some nebulous "free market" thing that does not exist as one thing, where that one thing can be responsible, or to be held accountable for lying to people, or stealing from people, or torturing people, or murdering people.

Am I correct in understanding that you describe the United States Government as well as some of the governments of other countries as political machines that manipulate and are manipulated by the market forces? (the nebulous entity?)
No, certainly not, there is no such thing, to be held responsible, or accountable, as a "government" so named, and if you look into The United States Government, as I have, you will find people, and you will find a few people in that group of people, in that United States Government, who are perpetrating fraud, extortion, money laundering, counterfeiting, robbery, rape, child rape too, kidnapping, kidnapping kids too, torture, murder, mass murder, and threatening to destroy all life on this planet, and those few people doing that have names, they wear pants, they breath air, and they collect the power they command in those ways described historically as crimes, and they make their crimes legal, and they punish anyone else daring to perpetrate those same crimes that they perpetrate. This "United States" crime spree, so called, has been going on since at least 1788, and I can provide the step by step documents proving the fact, as told by those who warned anyone caring to listen about those facts of those few who were, are, and will perpetrate these crimes made legal, under that False Front called "government" and specifically called The United States of America, which is a corporation, a Legal Fiction, a nebulous thing to be held responsible, accountable, so as to allow the actual criminals to be untouchable, unknown, and free from any power that might compete with their exclusive monopoly of crime made legal.


Furthermore, am I correct in understanding you to describe these "market forces" as being controlled by a relatively small group (when compared with the world population as a whole) ?

The reason I offered the thought experiment concerning the apples and the bags of poop, to illustrate a point, concerns the current real time actual choices you have for the money you want to use, and the money I want to use, and the money anyone on the planet Earth wants to use, to satisfy their demand for money, anywhere, on planet Earth, by any sane person, any human being, anywhere.

There are 12, why 12 I don't know, I can guess, but there are 12, people, with names, and they sit on the Federal Reserve chairs, where these 12 people, are legally allowed to write a check for as much money as everyone else combined, and that is now being called Quantitative Easing. That was once called Inflation.

You can find 12 other people too, and you can join in a session of brain storming too, and you can decide, as a group, unanimously, to write yourselves a check for as much money as everyone else combined, and then, just like those people at The Federal Reserve, you spend that money. The difference between your group and the group at The Federal Reserve, is that they get away with it, and you won't, because you will be kidnapped, and other things done to you, for spending all that money that you create, which is, in fact, in direct competition with exactly what those people at The Federal Reserve do, and those are mere words from me to you.


Furthermore, am I correct in understanding you to describe these "market forces" as being controlled by a relatively small group (when compared with the world population as a whole) ?
The people I call Legal Criminals keep a very precise set of books so as to allow them to keep doing business their way, to know exactly who they target, to know exactly how much they can get from their targets, and to know what to do exactly, to keep the power flowing from their targets to them.

Here is the false set of books, since they keep at least those two sets, the true set, and the false set of books.

National Debt Clock Real Time

I talk to your cousin Danny about this, over the years, and he is beginning, after so many decades, to warm up to the idea that he may not be as "up to speed" as I am, and so he listens more, and he now says things like "you were right", and "you were saying this for years", etc.

I get the feeling that people look at me and think that I went to sleep one night and woke up as "one of them" as if we are bad actors in the movie about the Pod People. I forget the name of the movie.

I'm one of those.

"Do you actually believe the things you say?"

Etc.

No, Mike, I do not believe that it is true, or a measurably accurate perspective, to blame things for the actions of actual people, so I do not believe in the validity of a Legal Fiction as anything but exactly what its inventors claim it to be, a fiction. I don't believe that there is this nebulous thing called "market forces" or a "free market" as such, instead, as such, those forces, or that POWER, can be measured, and those accurate measures are done very accurately in fact, and the science of marketing is a tool used to accomplish specific goals.

Edward Bernays  was a pioneer in the use of the science of mass marketing, and he was not governing his actions in a way that would limit the products of his work to only being accurate messages intending to inform the masses of people subjected to those messages produced by that person with that tool.

Back to the illustration of the apples and the turds, both called apples, on the same shelf, genuine apples at half price, and turds at double price, how many people, do you know, who would, if they could, turn a switch on, when they want to be lied to, and turn a switch off, when they prefer to receive accurate information instead, and I have a story about this, real time.

Danny says his kids are very good at fast manipulation of the television remote control, and they can quickly fast forward past the commercials.

As it happens I woke this morning trying to recover a viewpoint concerning this very thing. Having a "porn" filter on my computer, for example, whereby the box I check removes all the pornography of "official truth" which are all lies, and think in terms of that movie, if you saw it, with Jim Carey. Which porn do I prefer to censor if I have the power to censor out the worst of it?

Here:

Make a wish

So you don't think in these terms, as I do? You claim that I think (by your questions) in terms that are recognizable by you? Things are accountable for the actions of people?

If people have this power to switch off the destructive lies, seriously know they have this power, intuitively, or by way of learning from the environment, from external and not internal powers, free to choose to get free from those forces that hammer upon them from birth, to make people accept lies, and use lies themselves, a wild idea, sure, but having this power could be a simple switch on a box on your computer/t.v./phone/money, all of which are the same thing, connecting mediums, and those who are caught lying are turned off, not chosen, exiled from the shelf of choices.

A profound thing happened to me while watching Reality Television in 1993 as those events in Waco Texas were playing out LIVE.

At that time I was already well read on historical accounts of what happened in our world according to political and economic measures. It was my thing, I was doing my own studying. And then a T.V. Reporter says "They are Killing Themselves".

So I know that these people, kids, pregnant mothers, babies, teenagers, old people, and just people, are in a church, a church that is being called "a compound", and they have tanks now circling the Church, and as the tanks start driving into the church full of people, the church erupts into a ball of fire, and I know what is happening, and you probably know too, even if you refuse to believe what is happening, as the so called "government" (from the "TOP" down to the "boots on the ground"), slaughters these innocent people, after having tortured them, and experimented on them, and abused them, and used them, for months.

The T.V. Reporter informs me that these Wackos from Waco are killing themselves.

A switch became visible to me, at that time, to be resorting to another illustration, in answer to your welcome questions.

Vital questions.

No, you have me all wrong, and I can't write what does work, I've tried, communication is not possible, for some strange reason.

And if the answer to these two questions is yes, I do not see how refusing to pay income taxes and creating a competing medium of exchange accomplishes very much.
The turds on the shelf are Federal Reserve Notes and even if you fail to see what can be accomplished when competition is allowed in the business of Legal Money, that does not mean that other people do not see the value of it, as all those choices (demanding real apples and not settling for turds at twice the price), those market forces, that POWER, constitutes a force that works on the competitors who are competing to produce a higher quality and lower cost product.

I like to use the follow case in point, and you can read it relatively fast.

Reverse Interest money


Wörgl’s demonstration was so successful that it was replicated, first in the neighboring city of Kirchbichl in January of 1933.  In June of that year, Unterguggenberger addressed a meeting with representatives of 170 other towns and villages.  Soon afterwards 200 townships in Austria wanted to copy it.  It was at that point that the central bank panicked and decided to assert its monopoly rights.  The people sued the central bank, but lost the case in November 1933.  The case went to the Austrian Supreme Court, but was lost again.  After that it became a criminal offence in Austria to issue “emergency currency.” … does it sound familiar?  Only a central authority saviour can help people who are not allowed to help themselves locally.  Ans as all economists will point out, when there is enough demand, supply always manifests in some way.   Even if you have to import it.  During the Anschluss of 1938, a large percentage of the population of Austria welcomed Adolf Hitler as their economic and political saviour.   The rest is well known history.


However, if the answer to one or both of the above questions is no, then I see liberty day as a possible solution with several logistical steps still needing to be developed.
Many people are working separately on reaching Liberty Day sooner rather than too late, and here is a quote that I find relevant:
It is well enough that people of the nation do not understand our banking and monetary system, for if they did, I believe there would be a revolution before tomorrow morning. Henry Ford

I went to an event in Reno Nevada recently and I had a chance to talk to a speaker on the subject of a competitive Bank in Utah run by the people running the State of Utah. The speaker was the person hired by the people running the State of Utah, and they hired this person to help them produce a Gold backed Money System for their State.

I asked that person questions. I've written a lot right now so I won't repeat them without finding a demand for more words. I don't volunteer to waste my time, I turn off that switch - self-governing.
I also asked a question of one of the people who claimed to have survived the slaughter in Waco, back in those days when I had to know the truth about that mess.

There are steps being taken, logical steps, and a good case study, in my opinion, is the steps taken by Elon Musk.
Elon Musk is one of the people who started PayPal, and at that time, in their own words, they were going to take over the world, inventing, producing, and maintaining a competitive money.
Steps are being taken. It might be a good idea to get on the same page, and to set a date like they did in 1776.










 

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 Posted: Thu Mar 14th, 2013 10:53 pm
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kurtwaters
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Thanks Joe,

     I read it over. Over the coming days I will read more carefully. Thanks for taking so much time to answer those questions.

    I am working on lots of projects these days, not the least of which is trying to understand my son, Steven's, branch of chemistry which is crystallography.

    I feel I am back in school in a way.

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 Posted: Fri Mar 15th, 2013 04:19 pm
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Joe Kelley
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Mike,

I thought, with my primitive brain, that I had held my own when visiting at Tom's house awhile back, drinking beer, smoking cigarets, talking, playing chess, in Mike's ocean.

A precious memory, and it was tough returning home because I had to explain to Vicki what happened during that night out with the girls, your mom, and your sister-in-law.

Vicki felt betrayed, and I don't blame her, but I explained what happened as honestly as I could, and Vicki settled down, and we made up after the initial feelings of shock, I suppose. If I can't be free to act the way I will, then what will I become? I acted too free, but knowing I'd be explaining my actions, that night; so my primitive brain nearly got me in big trouble again; luck, or some other power kept me faithful, and that is just an aside, more free thoughts communicated, offered, with no intentional strings attached.

So...I'm thinking that now you are in my ocean, and I may think that I am a dolphin, and I may actually be a shark with a mirror that has a poster of Flipper pasted to the glass, and you are the Dolphin, or are you another Shark, or Killer Shark?

Competition for better viewpoints is not competition whereby one viewpoint destroys the other one, like having the wet tennis ball and the opponent dead in the water on the other side of the tennis court, returning the ball by the rules of the game.

The better, not the most devious, wins, or not, and who is to say which is which?

P.S. Thanks for the suggestions with my Aunt Maggie No Call Blues (formerly Sea Hag Blues). Tom, through Laurie, tried to help too, but there was some miscommunication concerning the 12 bar Blues goal I have in mind.






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